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Rossi Sells eCat

January 25, 2014

Rossi continues to surprise.

For some time, the inventor has been claiming he no longer has control over the strategic development of the eCat because he sold the rights to a company with deep pockets. He was obviously telling the truth. Industrial Heat LLC issued a press release confirming the acquisition and lending another layer of head-scratching credence to the eCat.

I remain sceptical for a number of reasons. However, I do not understand the absolute dismissal of this development any more than I understand the tendency by some to laugh at the Levi/Elforsk Report as a joke with no merit whatsoever. I agree without reservation that these things prove nothing and when we consider the fantastical nature of his claims, his propensity for embellishment or lies, his colorful past, the stream of overly-complicated demos and the money involved, it would be foolish to assume that this is the final piece of the jigsaw that will make everything whole. Scepticism is healthy and in the new energy arena, statistics are on your side if you assume that every new world-changing invention by a secretive businessman is covered in bullshit. You are more likely to be right than not but starting from the premise that Rossi is a fraud, working backwards and using this ‘fact’ to dismiss anyone saying anything positive about the subject is no more intelligent than believing everything you are told by a huckster.

Lets look at this objectively.

For all the reasons above, I’m not ready to jump ship to the believers’ camp. However, this Industrial Heat thing is interesting. I can easily see a group of businessmen getting the wool pulled over their eyes when they see dollar signs. In this case and at face value, these guys have a genuine interest in promoting green technologies that can make a difference and give a healthy return. It’s possible that they got ahead of themselves and failed to do due diligence but it is a leap to automatically assume that seasoned VCs – knowing the too-good-to-be-true nature of the beast – did not do their homework.

Out here, it is easy (and reasonable) for us to shake our heads at anything short of scientific validation but the list of people we have to assume as idiots or irrational just keeps getting longer and longer. Remember, these guys can read Rossi’s blog, too. They know what he is saying in public. He told us that his new partner built the eCat and tested it themselves. Let’s assume that’s bullshit. We have to then assume, they either didn’t see his comment, do not care about the lie or they have no argument with it. To some, the fact that IH’s press release makes no mention of this is a sign of… what exactly? It is quite reasonable to assume that they have not countered Rossi’s statement because there is truth in it. Be sceptical, yes, but let’s not start with assumptions and work backwards.

Solyndra, Madhoff, Steorn and thousands of other cautionary examples demonstrate the countless ways in which otherwise intelligent people can let themselves be fooled. For this and many other reasons, it’s always possible that IH has been tricked too. That said, it is one thing to recognise that possibility and another to start from the assumption and add the VCs to the burgeoning list of actors who do not know their arse from their elbow.

$11.5m is a droplet. Maybe they are just fishing. Maybe a lot of things. Beware though, of doing what you accuse believers of – twisting the order of logic to fit your conclusions.

I for one will be paying attention to what happens next.

Posted by on January 25, 2014. Filed under Business,Close Up,licencing,Rossi. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

1,521 Responses to Rossi Sells eCat

  1. Jami

    December 9, 2015 at 11:54 am

    Is the bunch on dummyworld really giving actual money to Steorn? I’d love to say they’re even dumber than I thought but I’m not sure that’d be possible.

    • Frank

      December 9, 2015 at 6:12 pm

      From Frank Acland, one month ago on ecw:

      I’m happy to report that the goal of $1300 in pledges has been reached. Thanks to all who have supported this effort! Now we need to wait until the units go on sale, which Steorn says will be in December

      An O-Cube is a device which supposed to be able to charge 2 smartphones a day… and has a price-tag of $ 1200 !!!
      Well, even if this device would work (e.g. by some kind of energy harvesting), who would buy it when you get a solar charger for 5% of the price of an O-Cube ???

  2. tony2

    December 9, 2015 at 5:18 pm

    The CEO of Steorn giving his explanation of how the Orbo works.

    SM: “I think what might be happening is that we are splitting time. I know that sounds absolutely nuts but I think that we are using the differences in the magnetic fields to manipulate time and that is leading to the creation of energy.”

    All righty, then. Time manipulation leading to energy production. One would think that that kind of process would lead to the generation of millions of amps – not just 2.

    But, then again, if I start with a charged device and plug it into the Orbo, if the Orbo sends the device back in time it will always be at the initial start point and always be fully charged. Now it starts to make a lot of sense!


    • Thomas Clarke

      December 9, 2015 at 5:56 pm

      This guy needs to talk to Axil – who does this stuff with so many more impressive long words.

    • Jami

      December 9, 2015 at 6:33 pm

      Thing is – it won’t work – even with mundane technology. The only energy these guys from Steorn can harvest is the calories from a pint of Guinness. They’ll take the money, sure, but there won’t be a delivery (unforeseen manufacturing/licensing/whatever problems) or there will be a delivery but it won’t work. So you send it back and they’ll eventually send a replacement much, much later which won’t work either until you lose interest and write off the money or insist and get a refund much later. Some people won’t insist and they’re the ones paying for Steorn’s Guinness for five years or so until the next Steorn scam is ready to roll.

  3. Al Potenza

    December 9, 2015 at 5:23 pm

    This is a hot link, not sure it will work:


    If not:

  4. Jami

    December 9, 2015 at 7:16 pm

    Looks like Georgehants has returned from a lengthy period of absence he evidently used to condition his brain to trigger belief in something with EXACT inverse proportionality to the chance of it being real. Quite an achievement – even by his standards…

    George about PESN:
    “Another very open-minded, uncensored, quality Website that makes the normal establishment hugging science comics look like the the old testament.”

    about dummyworld:
    “Wonderful to be on a scientific Website that follows scientific principles…”

    about Hutchinson:
    “… another link below that brings in the anti-gravity from Hutchinson.
    Another Cold Fusion?”

    To be honest – he does have a slight point there. Hutchinson is pretty much the same sort of obvious (to everybody except the likes of George) scam as Rossi or DGT.

    • Al Potenza

      December 9, 2015 at 8:25 pm

      Hants is sort of the lowest common denominator of stupidity, so profound, it border on insanity. NewsEditor on the Moletrap forum (formerly “007” on the Steorn Forum) is the equivalent for Steorn.

      Whatever these people say on any subject, you can bet your life on the converse.

      • JNewman

        December 10, 2015 at 12:19 am

        Reading this site is a welcome relief from the mainstream news. At least the stupidity displayed here is harmless.

  5. Al Potenza

    December 9, 2015 at 8:28 pm

    BTW, I have made an FOIA request for the paper which the believers think proved that Rossi actually had his thermoelectric scam device tested at U of NH and that the results were positive.

    The initial request was transferred to another office and now, the second office contacted me for an approval of payment (up to but less than $50) and they are proceeding to get me the document. They would not tell me the required time but if their previous response time is any indication, it will be within a month.

    • JohnP

      December 11, 2015 at 6:38 am

      Oh, my, Al! You mean that you are willing to unleash into the Rossi Continnuum the fact that Rossi lied! They know that…

      Al, Al, tread lightly. These guys make ISIS look like the Brownies. In two months the one year test of a machine that has been working for years, powering this and powering that. And it will be BLAHHH, or MEHHHH.

      Then YOU hit.

  6. Al Potenza

    December 11, 2015 at 5:50 pm

    Well, we now know Rossi’s plan if the current tests end up “negative.” He’s going to be a travel agent! What a renaissance man! Such versatility.

    Andrea Rossi
    December 11th, 2015 at 8:52 AM
    He,he…I answer with pleasure.
    Obviously, I answer based on my preferences.
    1- Washington, DC: the Smithsonian Institute is the most instructive museum I ever have visited. Among the many sections, it is mandatory to visit the Air & Space museum. A second concern of it is in the Washington Dulles Airport. Strolling between the Lincoln Memorial and the Capitol Hill, through the flags obelisk is unfergettable.
    2- Niagara Falls
    3- Yellowstone Park: the view of the Yellowstone Fall is the most beautiful natural sight I ever saw in my life. Impossible a description, you must go and see.
    4- New York: mandatory the Metropoitan Museum, the Guggenheim Museum and the Planetarium ( the best planetarium of the world).
    5- San Francisco
    6-Los Angeles
    7- Miami
    Miami ( half hour of flight from Orlando) and Los Angeles allow you to go to Disneyland if you have kids.
    For all this, with a good flights plan, you need 10 days plus 2 days for the flights to arrive and the flight to return to your Country.
    Schedule the long flights during the nights, so you can use the flights to sleep and save daytime for the visits.
    Obviously there are infinite other places worth to be visited, but in 10 days ( plus the 2 days for the trip) this is the best, I suppose.
    Remember to check with the closest US Consulate the VISA program before leaving.
    Warm Regards,

  7. Jami

    December 12, 2015 at 10:39 am

    Frank on dummyworld:

    “Yes, I sent funds via bank wire (the only means of payment until the webshop opens). On my invoice it says shipping date to be January 24th.”

    1,200 quid gone just like that. He could have spent that on real drugs and be happy ’til at least February 5.

  8. tony2

    December 14, 2015 at 9:12 pm

    E-can’t world is humming with the news that AR seems to be leaning towards the e-cat X for all future R&D. Who would have ever figured such a change in strategy would happen!

    Nobody except everybody here. The world creation over at the nuthouse is so rich and so detailed that it almost makes you forget that it’s just all made up. They speculate and conjecture on things that never happened and create past events out of whole cloth. Crazy.


    • JNewman

      December 14, 2015 at 9:43 pm

      ECW is pretty much akin to the website of the Flat Earth Society. A place where a small group of nutcases pontificate about their imaginary world. Everybody needs a hobby, I guess.

      • JohnP

        December 15, 2015 at 12:14 am

        Shame on you, guys! Only a skeptopath would fail to see that the Ecat-X is SOO much better than the Hot-Cat,… I mean the E-Tiger,… I mean.. yeah, that one!

        Just give His Renaissance Mind another year and another 12 millions from Darden and HA!

    • Shane D.

      December 15, 2015 at 2:25 am

      Like coming back from college only to see your old high school buddies still playing pool, drinking beer, making fart jokes at the old haunt. Stuck in a time and place. Life is just passing them by, but you just don’t have the heart to tell them.

      • Jami

        December 15, 2015 at 8:29 am

        … while you have moved on to the big world out there, seen things and done things and know things your old buddies can’t imagine in their wildest dreams. I can certainly see why those must be comforting thoughts for you.

      • popeye

        December 15, 2015 at 11:19 am

        I think you’re confusing college with a nuthouse, where the inmates are too crazy to be allowed to drink, too clumsy to play pool, and too gloomy to make jokes. And you’re homesick.

        • Shane D.

          December 15, 2015 at 4:10 pm

          I think it about that time of year you re-post your “why LENR is pseudoscience” piece. Best I’ve seen on the subject. If you do I was thinking of posting it, if you don’t mind, over at the nuthouse?

          It may help Thomas out too. He has been there so much lately that it seems to be softening him up. Understandable, as there are actually believers there that know the science pretty well. And also well versed in the history of successful experiments, and can convincingly argue their merits.

          • Thomas Clarke

            December 15, 2015 at 4:26 pm

            Softening me up?

            Shane: you confuse politeness (which I attempt) with lack of clarity (which I abhor).

          • Thomas Clarke

            December 15, 2015 at 4:39 pm

            Re pseudoscience.

            Popeye does a superlative job of summarising the top-level reasons why LENR is not a sensible belief. His says the things we all know with detail, rigor and clarity.

            So, rather than repeat that, I prefer to take on other (I would not say more difficult) challenges like why the F&P paper claiming 4X excess heat is unsound. Its good that there are real replies stating this, and replies to replies from F&P so that what is what can be discerned through comparison.

            I made the point over on Alain’s site (particularly applicable to Alain) that if you know a priori that LENR (which I define to be reproducible much higher than chemical excess heat – a phenomena not a theory and therefore misnamed) exists, any pro-LENR result becomes ordinary not extraordinary.

            It is not surprising that there are then pointless slanging matches between those who don’t believe this, and those who do.

            Even so, 99% of the evidence shown does not even pass an “ordinary” benchmark when looked at carefully.

          • JohnP

            December 15, 2015 at 8:13 pm

            Well, hello, Shane. There has been some “clucking” from you in LENR-Forum.

            I see you have grown feathers. How does it feel to be a chicken?

            I would suggest that you “grow a pair” but that would feel uncomfortable while sitting on the fence, wouldn’t it?

      • JKW

        December 15, 2015 at 1:45 pm

        Looks like you got it in the other way around, Shane. It is a constant Groundhog Day at the believe land. With slight variations: e-cat, domestic cat, fat cat, hot cat, NG cat, X-cat. Everything else stays the same.

      • tony2

        December 15, 2015 at 2:32 pm


        Tell us how you’re going to feel when Il Douche announces that the “test” results belong to the customer (or the “customer” was actually IH) and can only be released by them and that all work on earlier versions of the ecat is being terminated to work on the new, improved e-cat X. You know it’s coming, don’t you? Just like Christmas, the signs are all around you.


      • Thomas Clarke

        December 15, 2015 at 4:30 pm

        I’m oh so glad ECW has banned me. Otherwise I might be tempted to comment there on the obvious technical self-inconsistencies.

        It would not help, the guys there have mostly such a poor grasp of anything technical that when presented with a cast iron argument they just say:

        “That is obviously another thing we can’t understand”

        and since their world view involves a lot of things they can’t understand it does not set alarm bells ringing as it should.

  9. Alexvs

    December 15, 2015 at 5:32 pm

    Two russian scientists have written an article in JONP proposing a method to process radioactive waste. Not expert (nor patient) enough to read through the whole article but there you have the final conclusion:

    Technology advantages in the evaporation of DFE in the presence of a cheap energy source, such as E-Cat, allows the treatment of large amounts of accumulated liquid radioactive waste of low and medium level of activity in accordance with the IAEA at a minimum cost of treatment for final disposal.

    E-Cat, in its diversity, has arrived to such degree of perfection that not only generates heat, DC and AC power, electromagnetic waves (the path to the long ago predicted wireless E-Cat), it will also free the world of troublesome radioactive waste. If you all had followed JONP closely you would have known that an E-Cat variant can generate thrust in vacuum making interestellar travel a child’s game. All this thanks to an admirable man, Rossi the Inventor, who works uninterruptedly day and night, saturdays, sundays, Easter, Christmas, New Year, Epiphanie and even while being surgically operated.

    You incredulous people!

    • JohnP

      December 15, 2015 at 8:17 pm

      “E-Cat, in its diversity, has arrived to such degree of perfection that not only generates heat, DC and AC power,”

      Great, maybe you can give a non-existent shock to Shane’s non-existent balls?

    • tyy

      December 15, 2015 at 9:51 pm

      It is impossible to find errors in JONP articles. They are not even wrong.

  10. tyy

    December 15, 2015 at 9:49 pm

    New twists and turns! Entertainment factor is still there.

  11. Shane D.

    December 16, 2015 at 1:27 am

    I think some are following Thomas, and myself to LENR-Forum…the promised land of LENR milk and honey, but with changed IIDs.

    Starting to see some of the familiar insults there to moi, as I have grown accustomed to here as one of the three, at best, believers left here on ECNs.

    Forensically linking phrases, syntax, etc. hey I’m no English major, but can see patterns, it appears the migration may have begun.

    • JohnP

      December 16, 2015 at 6:48 pm

      Congrats, Shane. NewSpeak, as in taking anything from JONP as Revealed Truth, will win.

      The ONLY skeptic outlet is crashing. DoublePlusGood for the Believers. No way for ThoughtCrime to flourish anymore.

      You should be ashamed to be tied to that crowd.

  12. JohnP

    December 16, 2015 at 12:53 pm

    Have all comments been deleted?

    For a moment there they had all dissapeared…

  13. JohnP

    December 16, 2015 at 6:21 pm

    Wow. A Believer’s dream. The only place for reasoning skeptics doesn’t work anymore.

    From now on, any asinine comment by Il Douche will be unchallenged. Any fake replication from Moscow (where ambient humidity in winter is 20%) will be accepted as Gospel.

    O tempora, o mores…

  14. JNewman

    December 16, 2015 at 6:39 pm

    Well, it appears as if this thread is now broken. Posts appear in my RSS feed but I can’t see any of them on the site itself. Shall we find another old thread to start working in?

    And why won’t Paul simply start a new thread? Obviously he is willing to allow the site to continue, so why not take 2 minutes and fix it? Please?

    And as soon as I posted this, the thread magically reappeared (for moment at least.) My comment about Paul still applies.

  15. JohnP

    December 16, 2015 at 6:42 pm


  16. JNewman

    December 16, 2015 at 6:42 pm

    We could try this thread as a new place to hang out:

    • Al Potenza

      February 6, 2016 at 5:23 pm

      OK with me… this thread no longer works when I try to test it.

      Except for responses like this, I do not know where entries are ending up but they simply seem to disappear.

  17. NTAK

    December 22, 2015 at 7:09 pm

    Is this thing broken?

  18. popeye

    December 24, 2015 at 4:51 am

  19. popeye

    December 24, 2015 at 5:08 am


  20. popeye

    December 24, 2015 at 5:08 am


  21. popeye

    December 24, 2015 at 5:10 am