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Wired UK On Rossi, eCat, Hyperion & Defkalion

December 31, 2011

In one of the most upbeat and detailed articles yet in mainstream media, Wired UK talks about the mystery, intrigue and possibilities surrounding Andrea Rossi’s eCat. It is well written and maintains a healthy scepticism, focusing for some part on the rise of the ephemeral Defkalion. There are a couple of minor errors such as the following:

Like the E-Cat, Hyperion will initially be used for producing heat only, with electricity generation following. The first will be a one-megawatt device, the same scale as the one in Rossi’s demonstration in October.

Perhaps I missed the 1MW Hyperion thing. Anyone?

Overall, it is a good summary, one that ends 2011 well.

The article is here.

[With thanks to arian]

Posted by on December 31, 2011. Filed under Competitors,Defkalion,Politics,Press/Blogs. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

31 Responses to Wired UK On Rossi, eCat, Hyperion & Defkalion

  1. Pekka Janhunen

    December 31, 2011 at 8:10 pm

    Yes the 1 MW Hyperion is probably from the time before the split, so it’s an old forward reference to Rossi’s October fest. Wouldn’t be surprised if the reference is still somewhere on Defkalion’s pages.

  2. Camilo

    December 31, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Last lines from the article I think reflex what most of us feel right now.

    “The cold fusion bandwagon is rolling, with many tentatively putting one foot on it. Will it keep gaining momentum from here on until it changes the world?”

    I do not think this whole thing is a mistake or scam, but there is not much else to do than sit and watch, by the moment. I really hope that by march 2012, when and if the announced independent validation of Hyperions is known, it definitively changes the pace at which this whole story is moving forward. “stay tuned”. Happy 2012 to everyone!

  3. Married 2 my Yugo

    December 31, 2011 at 8:37 pm

    Notice maryyugo published comments almost immediately?

    Perhaps readers should reference her true nature:

    http://www.moletrap.co.uk/forum/comments.php?DiscussionID=1549&page=17

    • Al Potenza

      December 31, 2011 at 9:14 pm

      And your issue with the general thrust of those comments specifically is? I mean, respectfully, in what way do you disagree? Where are the major errors?

      • Renzo

        December 31, 2011 at 9:31 pm

        1) The problem with Rossi and Defkalion’s claims is that after a year, neither has ever had an independent test.

        Answer: this is false, we do know there have indipendent tests

        2) Defkalion has never shown an actual product in public.

        Answer: true, infact most of us are much more skeptical of Defkalion than Rossi

        3) Rossi has but the tests were always under his control and very arguable.

        Answer: this is complete nonsense

        4) Rossi promised to give devices to universities to test but he has never done so.

        Answer: the only contract is with university of Bologna and the expiry date is january 31

        5) As you note, his only customer is unidentified and we’re expected to believe that the unknown customer bought 12 more “megawatt plants” — actually each a collection of 50 or more modules. So the customer, we are told, has more than 600 modules. And what is he using them for? That’s secret.

        Answer: all the clues point to a military customers so anonimity is not out of place. The use has been said to be for heating remote camps

        6) None of this is credible!Rossi and Defkalion claims may be real but nobody will know until there is independent testing.

        Answer: this is only her distorted opinion not based on facts

        7) And it is not encouraging that their development has followed the same path as classical investor scams from such scammers as convicted felons Carl Tilley and Dennis Lee as well as Steorn’s “Orbo”, and many others.

        Answer: only in her dreams this has followed the same path as previous scams, this story is totally unlike any before!

        • Thicket

          December 31, 2011 at 11:28 pm

          Renzo

          1. Whether there have been independent tests is a minor matter. What matters is that we know of no tests, independent or otherwise, that validate Rossi’s claims.

          2. Agree.

          3. Any public tests were always under Rossi’s strict control. The private tests that we know about (e.g. Oct. 6 for customer, Krivit, Brown, some with Levi) were under Rossi’s strict control.

          4. Rossi said he would provide eCats to Bologna, Uppsala and one other Swedish university. There is no evidence that this has happened.

          5. There is no credible evidence that any military organization is an eCat customer.

          6. Independent testing is a fundamental scientific approach to validating a technology. That’s not an opinion. That’s a fact.

          7. Rossi is following a similar script to Steorn and other schemes/scams. Rossi followed a similar script to Lee and Tilley with his Petroldragon scam, for which he is a convicted felon.

          The eCat story is very similar to others. Lots of words. No proof.

      • Married 2 my Yugo

        December 31, 2011 at 11:31 pm

        I noticed the rapidity of the posting, comparison to Steorn, et cetera.
        My post prior does not imply any “errors”, nor considers an opinion; her views are well known.

        Although some claim it may operate similar to a disinformation agent
        previous posts on moletrap with base immature profanity suggest something far less worthy of consideration.

  4. Michael Robinson

    December 31, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    History doesn’t repeat itself, but it rhymes:

    http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA432046

    Leonardo Technologies, Inc.

    LTI was incorporated as a response to the thermoelectric power generation research by Dr. Andre Rossi. Dr. Rossi indicated that his devices would produce 20 percent efficiencies, a vast increase from the current science of 4 percent conversion of waste heat to electrical power. Dr. Rossi believed that he could increase the physical size of the TE Devices and maintain superior power generation. In furtherance of his research, in early 2000, LTI had tests conducted at the University of New Hampshire (UNH), Durham, NH, using a small scale LTI TE Device. Over a period of 7 days, the UNH power plant staff recorded voltage and
    amperage readings every 1/2 hr. The TE Device produced approximately 100 volts and 1 ampere of current, providing 100 watts of power. After this initial success, and a fire that destroyed his Manchester, NH location, Dr. Rossi returned to Italy to continue the manufacture of the TE Devices. In Italy, Dr. Rossi believed that LTI could manufacture more cost-effective TE generating devices with lower labor and assembly costs. Accordingly, Dr. Rossi engaged a subcontractor to fulfill the requirements of manufacturing and assembly.
    Unfortunately, the Italian subcontractor was unable to provide second-generation TE Devices with satisfactory power generation. Nineteen of 27 TE Devices shipped to CTC, Johnstown, PA, were incapable of generating electricity for a variety of reasons, from mechanical failure to poor workmanship. The remaining eight produced less than 1 watt of power each, significantly less than the expected 800–1000 watts each. Appendix C documents TE Device testing.

    In an effort to determine, and possibly correct the reasons for TE Device failures, LTI personnel traveled to the Italian laboratory. The common theme that began to emerge was the inability to upgrade from small-scale TE modules to large-scale multiple module TE Devices with large footprints. The most fundamental reason for the LTI second-generation TE Devices’ failure was the complex thermal expansion interplay among the various components. Contributing to the TE Device failure were the large number of soldered electrical connections (over 80), the inability to match the thermal expansion rates of the mono-block cooling tanks to the circuit boards and to the semiconductor materials, all within the clamp pressure or the retaining hardware in the grip of high temperature adhesives.

    After a month of research and observation at the Italian laboratory, it was determined that the best way to proceed would be to develop an independent laboratory in New Hampshire so that two development facilities could work at the problems from two separate locations and viewpoints. During this period of time, the Italian laboratory continued to deliver TE materials, but none that exceed the current science of TE power generation

    • LCD

      January 1, 2012 at 11:12 pm

      Great specific article. Thanks

  5. Charles Stewart Jr

    December 31, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    I’m still waiting for the customer for the first delivered ECat to release a STATEMENT THROUGH A TRUSTED 3D PARTY that the customer has the first unit and it is working and satisfactory. Yo customer, that would maintain your anonymity and lay to rest the FUD about ECat. Why don’t you Dr. Rossi, urge the same?

  6. Dale G. Basgall

    January 1, 2012 at 12:57 am

    I bet I know what Defkalion and Rossi wanted from santa, “a working e-cat for Rossi” and “a working hyperion for Defkalion”

    Going into 2012 for the first time without a bang, fireworks were outlawed in Hawaii last year. Oh well! happy new year ecantnews and posters on this site, from Hawaii!

    We need the e-cats working here, electric where available costs approx .48 cents per kw.hr. Most run on generators, solar, propane and so on and that costs more.

  7. Dale G. Basgall

    January 1, 2012 at 12:59 am

    error on new year wish, should have been ecatnews and not ecantnews, sorry admin. I look forward to this year on the site.

  8. Married 2 my Yugo

    January 1, 2012 at 4:35 am

  9. Casey

    January 1, 2012 at 11:23 am

    Well, it’s the new year and no absolute proof yet. I hope the wait isn’t too much longer.

  10. arian

    January 1, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    from andrea rossi

    to Sterling D. Allan

    We will start in Autumn the sale of the domestic E-Cat. We are organizing the production of 1 million pcs, to make a price enough low to allow to anybody to buy it….

    Had I accepted to enter the trap of the validations, all would have been stopped by a horde of wannabe competitors.

    By the way, making 1 million pcs and very low prices, the reverse engineering becomes a hobby, like to make yourself your car or your computer. The third-party-validators will party toying themselves with the E-Cat they will buy. Yes, We Cat!

    http://pesn.com/2011/12/31/9601996_Free_Energy_in_2011_Prepping_to_Take_Off_in_2012/

    • Dale G. Basgall

      January 1, 2012 at 2:18 pm

      Reply to arian, your post; I have read many things posted by you on several sites and I appreceate all the good positive things you have written, that’s great, however this post from Rossi hit’s hard this holiday season and I have always tried to reserve my replies to observed facts.

      This is a new year 2012 and statements like these by Mr. Rossi are going to sink as fast as lead balloons. Tripe is the only word clearly describing these types of posts from him and provide printable rubbish at best.

      In fact someone should invent a toilet paper printer that you can print as you sit, read and then use the paper later for a usefull purpose. That’s how I feel when reading anything from Rossi or Defkalion.

      I am an American and really love living in the United States, and it appears we are being taken down a rat hole with these types of propaganda.

      So I make this statement regarding the absence of the validation and claims of going forward with a non tested product intended to be “introduced into the U.S. for sale.

      Mr. Rossi & Defkalion, we in the U.S. will make better products than you could possibly think of or do yourselves.

      It appears niether of you (Rossi-Defkalion) has ever been into manufacturing on the scales you contend and are trying to “lead us to believe” you are capable of.

      Claims like both companies have issued from Italy have been obviously over exaggerated through the past year, and we do not want your troublesome non tested products. We need validation in the U.S. that these will be safe for others to use.

      We will push forward in the U.S. to refine a product that is safe and our government stamps for approval, and obtain a U.S. patent for it. I for one refuse to accept doing business with either of you due to the types of statement made for the last many months in 2011 regarding no testing and outright lying to the U.S. public stating you both have products but are not willing to produce any pictures of.

      If your product actually works, and if you ever get U.S. patents issued to you for them, expect to see me in Federal Court countersuing your companies for patent infringement. You have pushed this inventor to far by statements of non validation for safety purposes of your products which is unethical to the public.

      We are thankful you are just two small companies trying to make us believe you have products and not powerful political entities.

      • Andy Kumar

        January 1, 2012 at 8:11 pm

        Dale,

        Your opinion is too US-centric. I agree with you that US is a great country. I have been living here for 30+ years. But you forget that in the great scheme of things, the US technological prominence is a small blip in time. Other cultures have contributed their share. Before the last big war (WWII), most of the finer US minds used to go to Europe to get there education, just like people come from all over the world to US today.

        • Dale G. Basgall

          January 2, 2012 at 2:21 am

          Andy I appreciate the reply but I only used that as an example, I have not lived anywhere else but the U.S.

          Anyway I am feeling a change in me regarding this issue of Rossi and Defkalion sais, what bothers me is that every inventor gets kicked in the teeth over and over and bleeds from the knifemarks in their backs “as soon as” their product becomes worth millions.

          Anyway I have personally witnessed products going out to the public in the way the Italian companies are contending they are going to do this year. It always costs someone heartache and money when this scenario exists.

          So I am just trying to firmly send a message that we the public over here in the U.S. ( I was born in Oklahoma and raised in Kansas)want simply honesty and I am frustrated waiting for another unbelievable statement from Rossi or Defkalion.

          I sincerely do not want to prejudice any countries or people but the U.S. is the only situation viewpoint I can factually speak about.

  11. jim

    January 1, 2012 at 3:30 pm

    Comments remind me of Galileo and the church!

    Why does he not have it validated in the US?
    Because, according to the US there is no such thing as cold fusion and they refuse to even talk about it, much less examine a working device.
    Yes, there are scams. But, should we call all claims a scam without waiting to see if there is proof? Have you invested money in it? What else do you have to loose, other than your skepticism? My stand is to wait and see. And if/when it is on the market, I’ll buy one!

    • Al Potenza

      January 1, 2012 at 7:44 pm

      Well, Jim, the problem is that a lot of time has gone by without iron clad proof.

      If Rossi doesn’t give an ecat to the University of Bologna before the expiration of the January 2012 deadline for activating their contract, it will be very suspicious.

      If he does give them one, and the university acknowledges receiving it, it will be a good start towards accumulating evidence that the ecat is real.

  12. Tony

    January 1, 2012 at 7:46 pm

    Looks like I’ve upset Larsen…. Sounds like the ranting of a madman!

    “Dear TonyM: Believe??? Trust??? Exactly who??? You cannot possibly be serious. Unlike Mr. Andrea Rossi, neither Mr. Krivit nor I have EVER been convicted in a court of law and served mandatory sentenced time in a state-operated prison for committing crimes that involved technology-related businesses. If you really think that our publication and open discussion of incontestable objective FACTS, technical and otherwise, effectively constitute a so-called “hatchet job” on Mr. Rossi, then I suggest that you carefully study the meaning of that phrase; please see: Source URL = http://www.audioenglish.net/dictionary/hatchet_job.htm “HATCHET JOB”: The noun HATCHET JOB has 1 sense: 1. A false accusation of an offense or a malicious misrepresentation of someone’s words or actions
    Sense 1: Meaning: a false accusation of an offense or a malicious misrepresentation of someone’s words or actions Classified under nouns denoting communicative processes and contents — synonyms: calumniation; calumny; defamation; hatchet job; traducement; obloquy Hypernyms (“hatchet job” is a kind of…): depreciation; derogation; disparagement (a communication that belittles somebody or something) Hyponyms (each of the following is a kind of “hatchet job”): assassination; blackwash; character assassination (an attack intended to ruin someone’s reputation) malignment; smear; vilification (slanderous defamation) libel (a false and malicious publication printed for the purpose of defaming a living person) slander (words falsely spoken that damage the reputation
    of another) name calling; names (verbal abuse; a crude substitute for argument) epithet; name (a defamatory or abusive word or phrase) Given the above explanation of the meaning of “hatchet job”, your assertion is obviously false. If reading demonstrably objective facts about Mr. Rossi and his extraordinary claims involving his “E-Cat” technology are bothersome to you and not to your liking, then you might consider reading and reflecting upon some relevant scripture as follows: “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free,” John 8:32 in the American King James Version of the Holy Bible. Also see Chapter 7 verse 33 in a version of the Holy Qur’an translated by Abdullah Yusuf Ali where it is said that, “…things that my lord hath indeed forbidden are
    … sins and trespasses against truth or reason.” Lewis Larsen, President and CEO, Lattice Energy LLC “

    • Peter Roe

      January 1, 2012 at 8:08 pm

      Methinks he doth protest too much…

      Got a link to what you actually said to him to provoke such an outburst?

      • Tony

        January 1, 2012 at 9:40 pm

        It’s within the comments on Randy Hekman’s blog.

        • LCD

          January 1, 2012 at 11:25 pm

          Larsen is beginning to rub me the wrong way. His arguments on Rossi (attacking the character and not the totallity of circumstantial evidence in relation to successful experiments by, Miley, poantelli, ahern, and celani) and his weak argument against the term cold fusion (it makes the hot fusion guys sleep better) are not compelling.

        • Andy Kumar

          January 2, 2012 at 6:18 am

          Tony,

          Generally, I am a quite follower of LENR and do not like to post. But Larsen’s bullying attitude (unbecoming of a person of his stature) on Hekman’s blog prompted me to post this reply on the blog:

          Dr. Larsen, Where were you:), when I was learning English some 40 years ago. I spent a whole summer adding 6,000 words to my vocabulary working 8-10 hours a day. I firmly believe Rossi has something useful despite his past brushes with the law. I don’t think at this stage in life, Rossi or Focardi will be running a scam or Prof. Focardi will be delusional about what they have accomplished. They are just protecting their intellectual property by not doing full disclosure.

          I turned atheist at the age of 11, but your quoting of scriptures does not make me doubt your understanding of physics. I hope your LENR theory is validated. But I am aware that there are holes in the theory

  13. arian

    January 1, 2012 at 8:05 pm

  14. arian

    January 2, 2012 at 8:11 am

    Defkalion GT

    The 45kW multi-reactor Hyperion’s geometry and functionality allow us to fit 115 rack mounted of such units within a 20ft typical cargo container, leaving enough space for the heat management systems and the external heat exchangers as well as the room needed for inspection/maintenance/recharge. That is a 5175 kW (thermal) unit scalable from 5kW to 5,175MW* for industrial applications, not a one-megawatt device.

    The range of the MW Hyperion products will appear in the Greek market first, following the 45kW Hyperion licence and entry in the market within 2012.

    Happy new year to you and to all our forum members and guests
    DGT

    (*) arithmetic notation following the European/Greek system. 5,175 MW is 5MW and 175kW.

  15. Buffalo

    January 2, 2012 at 10:54 am

    No no people.let us calm down.we are asking the wrong questions here.who cares if rossi,s device is chemical reaction or nuke reaction,or wateva reaction.who cares about ‘proof’.proof o what?who,s going to throw money at a guy with nothing to offer? the only important question is: is it PROFITABLE to generate energy using a nickel-hydrogen thingymajig.case closed.we wait for the answer

  16. GreenWin

    January 3, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    Those who focus on Rossi and fabricated “brushes with the law,” do so because they have no empirical argument to contest LENR science. Ad hominem attack is a tired, old, out of date debunker tool thoroughly discredited as the work of paid flunkies.

    The science speaks for itself – it may not be Rossi/Focardi or Defkalion or Miley, Mills, Bushnell, McKubre, Josephson, Ahern, Arata, etc… who bring it to fruition. What we know, without considering Rossi at all, is the LENR effect is real science, peer reviewed, reproduced thousands of times around the world – and no one can explain it.

    Next step is do intelligent people run shrieking back to their caves peeing themselves cause they can’t explain how it violates one of their precious physical “laws?” Or do they act like adults and replace the old with new and far more beneficial science??

    What’s it gonna be?? More ign’ance? Or enlightenment?